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# Lenin set up Red Terror, remember; that crucial apparatus to 'control' his socialist society
Lenin gave that a go, then Stalin unleashed it with such stupidity, another fuckwit in Germany realized Moscow could be won given all the sudden depletion's in the Red Army's experienced ranks

Without Hitler's constant interference, Nazi armed forces could have achieved operation Barbarossa; they were hampered by the fact they were ultimately ruled by an idiot
(I helped save b3ta! Jahled Three shades of black, Sun 25 May 2008, 0:10, archived)
# I was playing Devils Advocate with much of that post.
But I will stand by my view that Hitler was the greatest politician of all time! Even if he was just a face for the men behind him.

Boris Johnson anyone?
(I helped save b3ta! Redsushi! Whoop! Whoop! Yes, that one!, Sun 25 May 2008, 0:14, archived)
# incidentally
you just reminded me I saw a fantastic video of bush today

it made something in my head go "EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE-clunk"

10 years of bush

pre senile dementia? my ass

coke abuse catching up or... something else

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
(I helped save b3ta! discomeats This canoe, Sun 25 May 2008, 0:20, archived)
# There was a video of him in about 2000 or it may have been earlier, in which an interviewer asked his position on invading other countries.
He said that he didn't think it was morally justified for America to interfere with international politics.

Hmm
(Jeru War and Piss, Sun 25 May 2008, 0:24, archived)
# my tinfoil is twitching agressively
put it that way

:D
(I helped save b3ta! discomeats This canoe, Sun 25 May 2008, 0:26, archived)
# No he wasn't
World War Two is a misleading term, Europe had been at war for a solid five hundred years; Paris was besieged by the Prussians in 1870, prior to WWI fifty years later; there would have been people still alive in 1914 who remembered the siege back then; and the Muslims were attacking Europe for centuries in case any one has forgotten about their 'crusades'

Hitler simply whipped-up a pissed off 'nation' that was fucking shat on by the French after WWI with war reformations. He simply picked up on the 'Blood and Iron' bit started by Hindenberg(?)

It's been shifting maps, lots of warfare and death, and nothing achieved much in all that time; so in a perverse sense the cold war quelled the need to rage where there was capitalism at least, except with angry left wing wankers with not much left to rage against except Starbucks, the precious martyrs
(I helped save b3ta! Jahled Three shades of black, Sun 25 May 2008, 0:28, archived)
# I wonder how long what passes for our current european stability will last
(I helped save b3ta! discomeats This canoe, Sun 25 May 2008, 0:34, archived)
# 6 months for us I'd say....
(I helped save b3ta! Redsushi! Whoop! Whoop! Yes, that one!, Sun 25 May 2008, 0:37, archived)
# funnily enough
that's about when I think rude pointy things will be dropping on iran
(I helped save b3ta! discomeats This canoe, Sun 25 May 2008, 0:38, archived)
# Well that's the way we counteract
these recessions and lose friends without a say nowadays isnt it?
(I helped save b3ta! Redsushi! Whoop! Whoop! Yes, that one!, Sun 25 May 2008, 0:50, archived)
# I think Hitler was essentially
a brilliant man. His motives for his people were nothing but good and in a time when the nation state was still very important ( and don't forget that Britain was at the arse end of a time when it had essentially run roughshod over most of the known world in a bid to be the dominant world force ) he was trying to bring back what he perceived ( in many ways correctly ) to be a great nation that deserved to be in better shape as it had been in the past.
Many of his ideas for this were of course flawed and in order to mobilise a very demoralised and beaten people then there needed to be a scapegoat. People of the Jewish faith provided this because they were as always the financiers of modern Europe and when many Arians were starving it was inevitable that Judaism would be a prime target.
This was nothing new and not something Hitler was responsible for. many sectors of society in many countries shunned the jew for much the same reason.

Hitler's radical answers for fixing this problem were not of course the way to go but don't forget that when Hitler decided on his invasion plans he did so with the understanding that Britain, being the closest thing to Germany in terms of people and politics, would join him in the endeavour so as to split Europe between the two powers. Hitler was always known to have been utterly perplexed as to why Britain would actually stand against him as he held this country in the highest regard.
Hitler was an outstanding politician. He was not much of a military tatician but he did have an eye for good men and put together an army that was better led and equipped than had ever been seen on the planet.
He was however declining into syphilitic dementia and as a result, paranoia, which led to a great mistrust of anyone so much so that his behaviour became erratic but there was nobody close at hand to keep him in check.
If Hitler had been either well or executed then there is little doubt that the war would have been much longer ( due to the fact that his generals would have fought only to their logistical limits ) but it's not likely that they would have lost with or without the late intercession of the Americans.
(I helped save b3ta! Pasanonic 's been known to cause insanity in laboratory mice, Sun 25 May 2008, 0:38, archived)
# not invading england was certainly a complete fail on their part
how long were we expected to be able to fight against them, 3 months or something like that?
(I helped save b3ta! discomeats This canoe, Sun 25 May 2008, 0:41, archived)
# Again,
Hitler never wanted to invade England, it just was never part of his plan. The English were as close to brothers to the Arians as he could imagine. He just assumed we'd be happy to take France, Spain et al in order for him to gain his real goal of regaining Prussia then the Balkan states because the whole motive for the expansion was for natural resources such as oil being that modern Germany had little of its own to sustain its growth.. ( ring a bell ?)
(I helped save b3ta! Pasanonic 's been known to cause insanity in laboratory mice, Sun 25 May 2008, 0:48, archived)
# yeah but surely he should have been clued into the fact that we were fighting against him
and yes, churchill himself wasn't exactly "fond" of france

but he was probably dolally at this point anyway so history was always going to be what it was

and bell ringing.. well

a power station every week
2 thirds of the worlds cranes
closed down, dissasembled factories and plant transported, rebuilt, copied.

you tell me, what's going to happen :D
(I helped save b3ta! discomeats This canoe, Sun 25 May 2008, 0:51, archived)
# To play DA again,
the big mistake that Hitler made was invading Poland in Operation Sealion. That forced our hand....
(I helped save b3ta! Redsushi! Whoop! Whoop! Yes, that one!, Sun 25 May 2008, 0:58, archived)
# they wanted their bit of land back did they not
it's all crap at the end of the day

fuckers making demands and getting little people to die for them

what's changed
(I helped save b3ta! discomeats This canoe, Sun 25 May 2008, 0:59, archived)
# Maybe,
I wont get into that, but that was the mistake that Hitler made. We left him alone for a while, but as soon as he invaded Poland, we had to act as a result of a long standing treaty that we had with them. And to be fair, Hitler destroyed that country and they have only really recovered in the last 15 years....
(I helped save b3ta! Redsushi! Whoop! Whoop! Yes, that one!, Sun 25 May 2008, 1:05, archived)
# They only recovered in the last 4 years by moving Poland to
Hammersmith.

/rant ( having said that I'm pleased Magda came but the less said about that the better )
(I helped save b3ta! Pasanonic 's been known to cause insanity in laboratory mice, Sun 25 May 2008, 1:11, archived)
# There is a massive debate and discussion to
be had over this and I don't have the space or balls to give you history lessons on b3ta, they'd kill me ;)

I do like to discuss this stuff though. I'm fascinated by all military campaigns and have studied some a great deal.

but before the war Hitler was certainly a man to be admired in his political rise. There has been no-one to match him since.
(I helped save b3ta! Pasanonic 's been known to cause insanity in laboratory mice, Sun 25 May 2008, 1:05, archived)
# I agree,
I dont think b3ta is a place for political discuusion in any depth really :)

But that does go back to my original point and belief that Hitler is and was the greatest politician that ever lived!

Yet I will state, as I always will have to, that he was a complete cunt with his abilities as a politician!
(I helped save b3ta! Redsushi! Whoop! Whoop! Yes, that one!, Sun 25 May 2008, 1:08, archived)
# it's not the history itself, it's what you learn from it
and I don't need a lesson in that, being a nobody in the scheme of things means I'm not the one that needs to learn it

(I helped save b3ta! discomeats This canoe, Sun 25 May 2008, 1:12, archived)
# Of course and nobody is nobody.
The whole point of stories are so that people can spread knowledge so everyone counts. I meant that I perceived you might have a couple of misconceptions about Hitler, his periods of sanity and those of brain wasting and as much as I'd like to get into that b3ta is not quite the place and besides we have run out of page.
We should invade someone's blog and get into it another time.
(I helped save b3ta! Pasanonic 's been known to cause insanity in laboratory mice, Sun 25 May 2008, 1:18, archived)
# there's plenty of germans that'll say
"I met him, and I know he was a good man"

that's their perception, and it was probably right when they met him, but then perception is everything.

What's good, true and right is a matter of context, if they'd won, everything they did, would have been 'right'.

and they'd have ran their own warcrimes trials

perspective is fun :D
sadly it always degenerates into the arse/opinion ratio which of course, is 1

Think we should just invade someone's blog anyway, that'll teach the twats with their crappy blog :D
(I helped save b3ta! discomeats This canoe, Sun 25 May 2008, 1:28, archived)
# The generals he produced were without doubt the best of the war, except perhaps Zhukov, and some of the US Admirals like Nimitz
Guderian was quite frankly the greatest of the twentieth century IMO, though it required fucking vast quantities of oil to keep his vision moving
(I helped save b3ta! Jahled Three shades of black, Sun 25 May 2008, 0:53, archived)
# you and I will no doubt be able to chatter
whilst the normals fade into drunken slumber ;)
(I helped save b3ta! Pasanonic 's been known to cause insanity in laboratory mice, Sun 25 May 2008, 1:22, archived)
# I didn't get an A level for such pointless military observations
oh well, take care geezer, need to sleep :)
(I helped save b3ta! Jahled Three shades of black, Sun 25 May 2008, 1:37, archived)